Watergate Hearings: Senate Select Committee on Presidential Campaign Activities - Testimony of James McCord.
Watergate Hearings: Senate Select Committee on Presidential Campaign Activities - Testimony of James McCord.
Master 10363 Part 1 Watergate Hearings: Senate Select Committee Hearings on Presidential Campaign Activities, May 18, 1973 - Testimony of James McCord (Jim McCord) Caucus Room, Russell Senate Office Building, Washington DC
Watergate Hearings: Senate Select Committee on Presidential Campaign Activities - Testimony of James McCord.
Senator Ed GURNEY. Let me ask something about the salary and money arrangements Mr. McCord, what was your salary at the Committee to Re-Elect the President for your security work? Mr. James McCORD. Salary was a gross salary of twenty thousand dollars a year. Senator GURNEY. Twenty-eight? Mr. McCORD. Twenty. Senator GURNEY. Twenty. Mr. McCORD. Twenty. Senator GURNEY. Now, that was the contract that is, the arrangement when you were engaged in what you were going to be paid, is that correct? Mr. McCORD. It was not the original salary, the original salary was 625 a month, approximately when I was first engaged as a consultant. Senator GURNEY. But that was for part-time work. Mr. McCORD. That's correct. Senator GURNEY. And then when you came on board full time, it was raised to 20,000 dollars. Mr. McCORD. Yes sir. Senator GURNEY. And when was that? Mr. McCORD. First of January, 1972. Senator GURNEY. Now then, as you have testified you learned from Mr. Liddy his curiosity about electronic devices and this lead of course to his asking you if you would participate in what we now know as the Watergate affair, and this occurred what date was that now approximately? Mr. McCORD. The conversations began in January ...... Senator GURNEY. I mean when you agreed to go into the Watergate affair. Mr. McCORD. Approximately, somewhere between thirty days after the initial conversation with Mr. Liddy, when he said he was going to see the attorney general in the attorney general's office, approximately at that period. Senator GURNEY. That would be as I recall probably in March sometime. Mr. McCORD. Late February, March yes sir. Senator GURNEY. Well, was there any raise or increase in salary around this time as far as your work was concerned? Mr. McCORD. There was none anticipated and none received. Senator GURNEY. Did it ever occur to you, if you were going to engage in rather hazardous activities, and they certainly resulted in that finally as we know that perhaps a higher rate of pay would be something that would be fair and equitable? As far as your concerned? Mr. McCORD. Oh yes, there was a prevision in the budget to which Mr. Liddy labeled as quote "overhead" which provided that compensation. Senator GURNEY. Would you describe that to the committee what that "overhead" was? Mr. McCORD. Yes, approximately two thousand a month during the period of time that the operations were underway. (pan of courtroom, audience listening to testimony) Senator GURNEY. And that began when? Mr. McCORD. April 1972. Senator GURNEY. And how was that paid? Mr. McCORD. In cash by Mr. Liddy. Senator GURNEY. How many of those payments did you receive? Mr. McCORD. There were payments through June, I think they totaled approximately 16,000. I do not recall specifically, but I got the notes here, I can I refer to them. Senator GURNEY. Now then, would you describe to the committee the other pay arrangements after the break-in and after you were apprehended? Mr. McCORD. Yes sir, the payments were made by Mrs. Hunt. Senator GURNEY. And in what amounts and at what time? Mr. McCORD. Calls came to me by Mr. and Mrs. Hunt in July and were paid in cash. There was a lump sum payment in August and July of 1972 for a five month salary 3,000 a month for a total of 15,000 dollars, subsequently legal fees. Senator GURNEY. And when was that? Mr. McCORD. In November as I recall it of 1972 and subsequently .... Senator GURNEY. And how much was that? Mr. McCORD. Total of 25,000 for the legal fees. Senator GURNEY. That was the November payment? Mr. McCORD. Yes. Senator GURNEY. Go on .... Mr. McCORD. And then the, again in November two months payment of 3,000 dollars each, total of 6,000 dollars. Senator GURNEY. So it was 15, 25 and six thousand dollars, is that correct? Mr. McCORD. That's correct. Senator GURNEY. And those all came from Mrs. Hunt? Mr. McCORD. That's correct. Senator GURNEY. Did anybody else pay you any cash? Mr. McCORD. No. Senator GURNEY. How much did you pay your lawyer? Mr. McCORD. Approximately, one lawyer thirty thousand dollars. Senator GURNEY. Thirty-eight? Mr. McCORD. Thirty. Senator GURNEY. Thirty. Mr. McCORD. Yes sir. (scrolling through papers) Senator GURNEY. ... and other payments? Mr. McCORD. sir? Senator GURNEY. Were there any other payments? Mr. McCORD. There were other payments to another lawyer which I had and Mr. Rothplat (sp?) which I made some payments to. Senator GURNEY. I don't particularly want to pry into that unless you want to give the information..... Mr. McCORD. Which ever you prefer.
Watergate Hearings: Senate Select Committee on Presidential Campaign Activities - Testimony of James McCord.
Senator GURNEY. I am interested in some other payments though. Weren't there payments made as far as either purchase of equipment or expenses in connection with the electronic business? Mr. McCORD. Oh yes, I testified to that in the executive session sir in which there was a total received of approximately 61,000 of a total of 76 in all for equipment and other related costs. Sixty-one thousand as an initial payment and about 5,000 subsequently for additional equipment purchases. Senator GURNEY. Now, did you say sixty-one and five? Mr. McCORD. Yes sir. Senator GURNEY. I thought you said ...... Mr. McCORD. There was a total of 76,000 in all which covered all payments for all purposes prior to June 17th, 1972. Senator GURNEY. There was another ten thousand payment later? Mr. McCORD. No sir, there was an initial 61,000 plus 5,000 for equipment, plus another 11,000 subsequently. But, a total of 76,000 dollars prior to June 17, 1972. Senator GURNEY. I don't want to quibble now, but I have 61, 5 and 11. Which totals 77, that brings to me. Total of 77. Mr. McCORD. Sixty one, I'm sorry sir, 61 and 4, 65 and 11, the total amount was 76,000 dollars. I'll get the figures. Senator GURNEY. Sixty four and eleven then I guess, is that it? Mr. McCORD. I can recite them for you sir, April 12 sixty one thousand dollars plus four thousand dollars, a total of sixty five thousand dollars. May 8th, four thousand dollars. Memorial weekend, two one thousand dollar amounts, in June five thousand, a total after May 8th of eleven thousand, the total of that is seventy six thousand dollars. (shot of man wearing sunglasses, smoking in courtroom) Senator GURNEY. Now then, how was this dispersed? Mr. McCORD. In cash by Mr. Liddy. Senator GURNEY. I mean how did you spend it? Mr. McCORD. Would you like the expenditures? They were expended in cash for the most part, there were some by check for some walkie-talkie equipment. Senator GURNEY. Do you have a detailed account of how you spent it? Mr. McCORD. Oh yes sir. Senator GURNEY. Do you have it with you? Mr. McCORD. Yes sir. Senator GURNEY. Is it a long one that would take some time? Mr. McCORD. Yes sir, it's rather lengthy. Senator GURNEY. I wonder then Mr. Chairman if we could receive that in evidence, I don't really see any point in going all through that. Senator Sam ERVIN. If you let the committee have the account, we'll make a copy and return your copy, original to you. If you prefer that. Mr. McCORD. Alright sir, we will do that. Senator GURNEY. But my understanding is that the account which you are going to present the committee, shows the complete disperse and spending of the 77,000 dollars, is that correct? Mr. McCORD. 76,000. Senator GURNEY. 76,000 dollars. Mr. McCORD. As I recall it, that's correct. There were budget receipts and so on that were prepared on us and were shown to Mr. Liddy preceding for all the payments.
Watergate Hearings: Senate Select Committee on Presidential Campaign Activities - Testimony of James McCord.
Senator GURNEY. Just one other question. There was some discussion earlier this morning about the Elsberg case, and my recollection is that your testimony was that there was no connection between the Elsberg case and Watergate, is that correct? Mr. McCORD. No sir, that was not my testimony. My testimony was that I had no knowledge of the wire-tapping that allegedly occurred in connection with the Elsberg case, nor did I have any knowledge of the break-in, in connection with the doctors records of Mr. Elsberg, that was the intent of my testimony. I'll make that correction now if I have misled you. Senator GURNEY. Well, do you think there is some connection between your watergate operation and the Elsberg case? Mr. McCORD. There apparently is in the personnel that was involved, yes sir as I understand it from the newspapers, I do not know for a fact. Senator GURNEY. But not as far as you and the people under you were concerned. Mr. McCORD. I had no people under me, except for Mr. (unclear) Senator GURNEY. I'm talking about those in the Watergate affair. Mr. McCORD. I do not know the role of the others in the Watergate and whether they may or may not have been involved, they have been so reported in the papers, but I do not know for a fact. Senator GURNEY. My reason for asking this I understand there was electronic equipment which was obtained I think by Mr. Liddy and Mr. Hunt in the Elsberg affair, and they of course did have supervisory control or authority over you to some extent. Did you use any of that electronic equipment, or did you purchase all your own? Mr. McCORD. I do not know what the electronic equipment was that you are referring to here sir. Senator GURNEY. Well all I know is what I read in the newspapers on that, but did you purchase all of the electronic equipment and devices that you used? Mr. McCORD. That I used, yes sir. I don't know what Mr. Hunt used. Senator GURNEY. Thank you that's all.